Our Next Case

[jdeuce23]

May 8, 2018 13:15:54 GMT slim said:

May 8, 2018 11:49:50 GMT jdeuce23 said:

You're right, I misspoke. This isn’t happening all over the US, these deaths have been mostly concentrated in the Midwest. 

Again, I’m sure many people have gotten so drunk they’ve fallen into water and drowned. But the similarities of the deaths in these cases are pretty striking: all of them college aged, athletic white men who were not otherwise known as troublemakers or party animals. I believe one of the victims was seen getting picked up somewhat forcibly at the side of the road in a car by a witness, another made a call to a friend saying he was being followed before disappearing. And it’s not like all these bars are right on the shores of bodies of water...some of the victims would have needed to cross several roads to get to water, and it isn’t easy to stumble drunk that far without getting hit by a car first.

From what I know, it seems like this couldn’t be the work of just one serial killer, it would need to be a network of them. That’s where I start having doubts...that seems implausible to me. I don’t believe the police are even investigating these as homicides, which is obviously different than something like the EAR. It’s a very fascinating case, nonetheless. 

Yea its mainly been upper Midwest cities, college towns along rivers. I cant speak for every city. But in Eau Claire a very popular stretch of bars and restaurants is right along the river. Literally the bike trail and walking trail along the river is right behind the back wall of these places, that's how close it is. Same with Lacrosse, WI, the main bar hopping street is only like a block or two from the river. So its not out of the question that if you were really drunk to end up down there. Its weird as hell i know. If you big picture it you would definitely think something is going on other then just drunk college men drowning at night. What I don't get is not one case has involved a woman, not one. All have been men. Its not like woman aren't going out to bars and not getting drunk as well. Why are they making it home and not the man? 

Yup.

Not to totally hijack this thread, but you're basically left with three possibilities:

- This is the work of a serial killer, or group of them, who have operated for two decades undetected and continue to do so completely off the radar, pulling off these murders throughout a large part of the midwest and upper north...and they are taunting cops with smiley faced graffiti. Seems extremely unlikely to me.

- Some of these may have been drunken drownings, others may have been homicides...but all of them are unrelated. Possible, but still leaves a lot of very weird and unanswered questions, and you have to ignore what seems to be pretty compelling evidence that something strange is taking place. 

- All of these were completely unrelated, and it's pure coincidence that they were 100% men (as you pointed out) who were athletic, in college, and got so drunk that they wandered into water, sometimes as far as a half mile away. Also seems unlikely to me. I'm not a big drinker, but have been up close and personal with some people who were completely smashed out of their minds, I don't think I've ever seen one who decided it was a good idea to just walk into a lake or river and see what happens. I would think most bartenders would stop serving people who became that visibly drunk, or their friends would start thinking about how to get them home safely.

I can't even piece together a theory on what would be happening. In almost all the cases, the victims were separated from their groups of friends...and there is only one thing that could lure a guy away IMO, which would be a woman. Does that mean this woman (and/or group she's associated with) is traveling all the way from Minnesota to Wisconsin to Pittsburgh to as far east as Boston to perform these killings? 

Every angle you look at seems extremely odd. If anyone else feels like taking a look, here is a good starting point:

footprintsattheriversedge.blogspot.com/

[nyc123]

May 3, 2018 4:06:15 GMT leviathan said:

Let’s find Maura Murray!!

Yes...her disappearance was very weird...

[liffer]

I’m good to go with the Smiley Face Killer. I know it seems unlikely that a semi-organized band of serial killers has been active for two decades, but it seems even less plausible that over 40 successful, attractive young men have fallen into bodies of water in states of extreme drunkenness during that time, especially when this seems to occur in the same areas over and over. And the phenomenon only seems to include white men, and no women. Blacks and women like to drink at bars too, so their absence from the victim pool seems strange. Also, apparently, some of the victims were not even near the water when they went missing and others made distress calls shortly before they disappeared. It’s just too strange.

Other cases I would love to sleuth are:

Jodi Huisentruit
The very large numbers of people missing from national parks (Missing 411 series)
Colonial Parkway Killer
Connecticut River Valley Killer
Delphi
Amy Bradley

I think Zodiac, Jennifer Kesse, Springfield Three, JonBenet, and Maura Murray are all super fascinating too, but it seems there are already so many fora, podcasts, etc. devoted to them that another might be overkill.

[michael]

There will never be again a case like this (EAR/ONS).

[kellyjelly]

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jason_Derek_Brown

[kellyjelly]

Apr 27, 2018 5:43:25 GMT shayne78 said:

Apr 26, 2018 14:44:03 GMT davpel said:

Yes, the case was life-changing for those of us who lived in the area at the time (I was around 8, the same approximate age as his victims and from the same location). Like EARONS, the OCCK changed our definition of safety and crushed our sense of security. The clues and leads which have come out in the intervening years are as shocking and disturbing as the crimes themselves. What were thought to be the actions of a lone killer likely were the result of child molestation "clubs" and the assumed killer appears to have been someone of great privilege whose identity prosecutors and LE may have willingly concealed. An absolutely fascinating case in all respects. 

Take a look at this drawing, which was found in the home of the individual who many now believe was the killer after his suicide. The drawing closely resembles one of the OCCK's young victims, Mark Stebbins. To me, it is just as horrifying as the "Gonna Kill Me" call which is what drove me to become obsessed with the EARONS case. 


[image deleted, by Drifter]

That drawing is infinitely more horrifying than the EAR call. So scary.

It's definitely terrifying!

[bear]

Let’s find Jennifer Kesse!

[cerulean]

Apr 25, 2018 22:24:09 GMT barneyonebulletfife said:

I've got something digging up my yard that I need solved. I've narrowed it down to
Mole
Ground Hog
Hedge Hog aka "I'm not Ron Jeremy"
Dog
* Neighbor
Team of Ants that are dicks
Crawdad or team of Crawdads that are dicks
Possum aka "Lil George Jones"
Maybe we can put my mystery on hold & solve a more important case 

Im ready to get down in the mud with you on this one, barney.
Save

[cerulean]

Apr 25, 2018 22:48:56 GMT crackerjack said:

I agree with Windsor Castle. Much more to learn here. I find the conviction of Clifton deplorable for the Donna Richmond murder. It truly makes no sense. Police did all they could to land this on him. What about DeAngelo? He worked there during this period and left right after the murder. Donna was riding her bike home at 4:00 and her route could easily go down C St. That is current address of Exeter LE. If he did shoot at McGowen, what would stop him from killing Donna? Some will say I have an overly active imagination. Perhaps. There was no justice for Donna, Jennifer Armour, Prof. Snelling and many more that followed. There are some great minds here and hopefully justice can be secured for others. I qualify my comments be saying I don't know whether DeAngelo worked out of HQ. They had sub stations.

Donna and Jennifer definitely sound like him.  Is there a definite answer on whether or not they have DNA? Do they have anything at all saved?
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[keysersuzy]

Amy Mihaljevic...And maybe the series of 1970s and 80s stranglings in Placer County that I noticed when looking for info on JJD. And no, I don't necessarily think he was involved. Bodies lining the freeway was a fairly consistent description of California in the 70s and 80s. I'm just now super familiar with unsolved cases in Placer and Sacramento Counties.

I'd like a case where database searching will be of use though, so if anyone has a good case suggestion, I'm open. I'd prefer not to work on a case in a state with a lot of closed records.

[cerulean]

Apr 27, 2018 5:43:25 GMT shayne78 said:

Apr 26, 2018 14:44:03 GMT davpel said:

 The drawing closely resembles one of the OCCK's young victims, Mark Stebbins. To me, it is just as horrifying as the "Gonna Kill Me" call which is what drove me to become obsessed with the EARONS case. 

That drawing is infinitely more horrifying than the EAR call. So scary.

Yes; and some people dont want to scroll onto a child being tortured. It should be linked offsite.
SaveSave

[keysersuzy]

I have no idea if the people that did the 12-26-75 podcast are on here. I'm guessing that they post on this site (I'm obviously new here), but I don't know their user names (or actual names). I'd love to work on any case that they are. They are super logical and tenacious...

[cerulean]

Im glad I dont know half these cases, and I think I'll be happy to stay that way.

Abt the Smiley Face Killer. I only know this in passing but, what do actuaries say about this kind of victim type drowning, and how to they stack against the regular drownings of regular non-athletic young college men that are also sure to be happening in those places?

Since when do drunk people simply not 'decide to go into water'? I dont think it works that way, poster. And especially when you can fall into it, which sounds totally possible on the Eau Claire bar run described, above.

Why no women? First, is that really true? Id like to know the rates at which all types of people drown in these rivers, annually, going back through the years these men were found.
Also women are more culturally conditioned to not wander off alone, for obvious reasons.
They also dont usually try to urinate into a river, like Ive got to believe a lot of men , do. Especially men who've been drinking.

And smiley faces have to be one of the most popular things to grafitti onto public spaces, along with penises. I have a feeling, cops know this.

[keysersuzy]

May 8, 2018 17:02:03 GMT nyc123 said:

May 3, 2018 4:06:15 GMT leviathan said:

Let’s find Maura Murray!!

Yes...her disappearance was very weird...

I thought they found her in Quebec and she doesn't want to be found.

[keysersuzy]

Apr 25, 2018 22:44:14 GMT slowpokebread said:

Mad Butcher of Kingsbury Run!

It was my top one.

Such a good one! If you're local and haven't gone on the torso murder tour, highly recommend. Took my mom for mother's day.