Amazing Profilers that got it right

[morf13]

Jun 11, 2018 3:06:44 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

 FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole, and FDLE profiler, Leslie D'Ambrosia.
All of the following was said by them before he was caught, it comes from Unmasking a Killer and that program was completed and in the can in 2017.

D'Ambrosia said, "he's alive and he is among us!"

D'Ambrosia said, "It's my opinion the Visalia Ransacker is the East Area Rapist who became the Golden State Killer"

D'Ambrosia: "This guy is not going to want to stop so I don't believe he would have stopped. He would need to do something that was satisfying to him."

Seems that O'Toole is disagreeing with D'Ambrosia here. She said "We know he was gratified by murder but that doesn't mean he isn't satisfying his urges and desires in other ways. The ligatures followed him through his sexual assaults and followed him through the murders and because of that behavior following him for that period of time, I think that's one of his strongest paraphilic behaviors."

D'Ambrosia: "So today I would expect to see bondage with his relationships. Perhaps he has a compliant partner engaging in bondage."
(Hmmm? Is that why Bonnie, the girlfriend, broke up with him? There undoubtedly were many reasons to break up with him before it could have gotten to that point though.)  

D'Ambrosia: "I firmly believe there are people out there who knows who he is"

D'Ambrosia: I think there are women who dated or married him who say, "you know, I think he might be the guy."

O'Toole said "To demonstrate that level of violence, it has to in part come from his family home." She said there was sexual pathology and violence in that family. She said some paraphilic behavior happened to him as a little boy. IT COULD BE HE WITNESSED IT. He could have been sexually molested OR A SIBLING.
(as a 10 y.o. he witnessed his 7 y.o. sister being raped according to what this sister told her son/his cousin, and it has been reported his real father beat his mother.)

O'Toole: "It's very likely we do not know all of his crimes."

O'Toole: Is sure he would have kept his trophies to this day. She said that even if he knows if they are found it could put him on death row, he'll keep them" . And she said he may have gifted jewelry etc. to a girlfriend or wife and get pleasure from seeing her wear it.

D'Ambrosia doesn't seem to be so sure, she says he was into self preservation. (I'm not sure if that statement was indicating she thinks perhaps he would not have kept the trophies. I think that's what she means but it's not crystal clear.)

ROY HAZELWOOD, Profiler (another case with parallels to this case):

Roy Hazelwood said “peepers” choose victims of opportunity”! And he said they probably live within a few blocks.
(note: Hazelwood is talking about peepers and is not mentioning rapists.)
Edmond, Oklahoma, A peeper (Jonathan Graham) entered the house with intent to rape. When he unexpectedly encountered a male in the hallway, he stabbed him to death. He then proceeded to raped the woman.
Hazelwood's Profile: Age 22 to 27, Education: hi school graduate.

Hazelwood said the KILLERS WEIGHT WOULD FLUCTUATE, would have been traumatized from unexpectedly killing a person. Hazelwood said the perpetrator would look for a LEGITIMATE REASON TO LEAVE TOWN.
As Hazelwood predicted Graham did lose weight after the crime and found an excuse to leave town -- he joined the army.

NOTE the similarity: DeAngelo, did find an excuse to leave Visalia after the McGowen shooting, a change of jobs.
                              DeAngelo did lose weight which threw everyone off because of the discrepancy between the pudgy Ransacker and the thin EAR.

I've been trying without success to find another article about a profiler that said serial rapists tend to travel great distances.  I am now seeing how that ties into DeAngelo too.  He lived in Auburn and traveled to Contra Costa County, Stockton, Modesto, San Jose and So. California all while living in Auburn.  (There is an indication that at some point they did live in Los Angeles as their second daughter was born there in November 1986.)

If you want to see how much D'Ambrosia got wrong(quite a bit)see this thread:

earonsgsk.proboards.com/thread/1737/fdle-profile

Not trying to single her out, just that her profile of the EAR/ONS is the major one that's out there, and shows maybe it's time to reset what we think we know about serial killers. Then again, police did several geo-profiles on where they thought EAR & VR likely lived, and none of them were even close, so everybody missed all around as did many of us amateurs

[Any of N]

For this case, the criminal profiliers do not deserve our scorn, but neither do they deserve to be placed on a pedestal. They were right on some things and wrong on others. That pretty much sums it up.

cleopatra -- We're more in agreement than not. The profiles that were publicly released had some value. I still say that there were no major insights that cut through the noise and put everybody on the right track. At this point it's cliche to cite how Hollywood and the popular press has bestowed shaman-like qualities on that profession. The push-back tends to be overdone at times, but one can see why it occurs. Like you, I'm usually more in the middle.

[cleopatra]

Jun 15, 2018 11:26:33 GMT morf13 said:

Jun 11, 2018 3:06:44 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

 FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole, and FDLE profiler, Leslie D'Ambrosia.
All of the following was said by them before he was caught, it comes from Unmasking a Killer and that program was completed and in the can in 2017.

D'Ambrosia said, "he's alive and he is among us!"

D'Ambrosia said, "It's my opinion the Visalia Ransacker is the East Area Rapist who became the Golden State Killer"

D'Ambrosia: "This guy is not going to want to stop so I don't believe he would have stopped. He would need to do something that was satisfying to him."

Seems that O'Toole is disagreeing with D'Ambrosia here. She said "We know he was gratified by murder but that doesn't mean he isn't satisfying his urges and desires in other ways. The ligatures followed him through his sexual assaults and followed him through the murders and because of that behavior following him for that period of time, I think that's one of his strongest paraphilic behaviors."

D'Ambrosia: "So today I would expect to see bondage with his relationships. Perhaps he has a compliant partner engaging in bondage."
(Hmmm? Is that why Bonnie, the girlfriend, broke up with him? There undoubtedly were many reasons to break up with him before it could have gotten to that point though.)  

D'Ambrosia: "I firmly believe there are people out there who knows who he is"

D'Ambrosia: I think there are women who dated or married him who say, "you know, I think he might be the guy."

O'Toole said "To demonstrate that level of violence, it has to in part come from his family home." She said there was sexual pathology and violence in that family. She said some paraphilic behavior happened to him as a little boy. IT COULD BE HE WITNESSED IT. He could have been sexually molested OR A SIBLING.
(as a 10 y.o. he witnessed his 7 y.o. sister being raped according to what this sister told her son/his cousin, and it has been reported his real father beat his mother.)

O'Toole: "It's very likely we do not know all of his crimes."

O'Toole: Is sure he would have kept his trophies to this day. She said that even if he knows if they are found it could put him on death row, he'll keep them" . And she said he may have gifted jewelry etc. to a girlfriend or wife and get pleasure from seeing her wear it.

D'Ambrosia doesn't seem to be so sure, she says he was into self preservation. (I'm not sure if that statement was indicating she thinks perhaps he would not have kept the trophies. I think that's what she means but it's not crystal clear.)

ROY HAZELWOOD, Profiler (another case with parallels to this case):

Roy Hazelwood said “peepers” choose victims of opportunity”! And he said they probably live within a few blocks.
(note: Hazelwood is talking about peepers and is not mentioning rapists.)
Edmond, Oklahoma, A peeper (Jonathan Graham) entered the house with intent to rape. When he unexpectedly encountered a male in the hallway, he stabbed him to death. He then proceeded to raped the woman.
Hazelwood's Profile: Age 22 to 27, Education: hi school graduate.

Hazelwood said the KILLERS WEIGHT WOULD FLUCTUATE, would have been traumatized from unexpectedly killing a person. Hazelwood said the perpetrator would look for a LEGITIMATE REASON TO LEAVE TOWN.
As Hazelwood predicted Graham did lose weight after the crime and found an excuse to leave town -- he joined the army.

NOTE the similarity: DeAngelo, did find an excuse to leave Visalia after the McGowen shooting, a change of jobs.
                              DeAngelo did lose weight which threw everyone off because of the discrepancy between the pudgy Ransacker and the thin EAR.

I've been trying without success to find another article about a profiler that said serial rapists tend to travel great distances.  I am now seeing how that ties into DeAngelo too.  He lived in Auburn and traveled to Contra Costa County, Stockton, Modesto, San Jose and So. California all while living in Auburn.  (There is an indication that at some point they did live in Los Angeles as their second daughter was born there in November 1986.)

If you want to see how much D'Ambrosia got wrong(quite a bit)see this thread:

earonsgsk.proboards.com/thread/1737/fdle-profile

Not trying to single her out, just that her profile of the EAR/ONS is the major one that's out there, and shows maybe it's time to reset what we think we know about serial killers. Then again, police did several geo-profiles on where they thought EAR & VR likely lived, and none of them were even close, so everybody missed all around as did many of us amateurs

We know for a fact the baby was born there. That doesn't necessarily mean they lived there.

I have three sisters. I am the second child. All of my sisters were born in San Francisco. I was not born in the State of California. My mother and sister who is a year older than me were staying with my aunt (my mom's older sister) while my father was on a business assignment in Europe. If my father were not out of town and so far away, I'd have been born in San Francisco.

Joseph and Sharon Huddle bought a home using a VA loan in Sacramento County in 1980. I'm not sure if it's the one in Citrus Heights that JJD was arrested at. I didn't come by a sale of property after that purchase, just a title change where Sharon's name was dropped from the deed. So someone was still living in that house during the SoCal murder sprees. Perhaps Joe would be going to SoCal to visit Sharon or his brother, John, or his mother, and while there he commited his crimes.

[Agent99 aka Sandia]

Well, Morf, the profiles are actually educated guesses and look how long ago they were done.

The EAR profile was done in 1977 and the ONS profile was done in 1998, so 41 years ago 20 years ago respectively. The ONS profile didn't include the Santa Barbara crimes because Santa Barbara said they were not connected. Santa Barbara said the EAR didn't murder but raped, and the Santa Barbara killer murdered and didn't rape. The Santa Barbara victims were shot, the Ventura and Orange County victims were bludgeoned and raped.

Sacramento said Visalia was not connected.

D'Ambrosia didn't have complete info on all his crimes. I don't think it's reasonable to think she would get it all right. I think she was amazing though. Like I mentioned there are other profilers that really make no predictions, just state what is already known to us. She stepped out and predicted.

Another element is that they were dealing with a cop that had lots of education and training on being a cop. He knew how to alter evidence, leave false clues etc. and she did suspect that. She did say it looks like he had knowledge of police investigative techniques and training.

We've all been fooled by this misfit. This monster was was very good at being a criminal, I give him an A for being a criminal. But I give him an F in life. He failed being a human being.

Wait, take it back. Look where he is. He failed at being a criminal too. LOL

Another side note observation: in the poem Excitement's Crave "Sacramento should make an offer, to make a movie of my life that will pay for my planned exile."

Well his planned exile will be free for him. Not quite what he planned. Gourmet meals, fresh air, beautiful vistas, the finest linens, wonderful company, the best service, lots of fun fishing and boating expeditions.
Yes, just so much fun awaits him. LOL The movie will be made and the proceeds will go to his victims and their families, not him.

[Agent99 aka Sandia]

Jun 15, 2018 17:38:41 GMT cleopatra said:

Jun 15, 2018 11:26:33 GMT morf13 said:

If you want to see how much D'Ambrosia got wrong(quite a bit)see this thread:

earonsgsk.proboards.com/thread/1737/fdle-profile

Not trying to single her out, just that her profile of the EAR/ONS is the major one that's out there, and shows maybe it's time to reset what we think we know about serial killers. Then again, police did several geo-profiles on where they thought EAR & VR likely lived, and none of them were even close, so everybody missed all around as did many of us amateurs

We know for a fact the baby was born there. That doesn't necessarily mean they lived there.

I have three sisters. I am the second child. All of my sisters were born in San Francisco. I was not born in the State of California. My mother and sister who is a year older than me were staying with my aunt (my mom's older sister) while my father was on a business assignment in Europe. If my father were not out of town and so far away, I'd have been born in San Francisco.

Joseph and Sharon Huddle bought a home using a VA loan in Sacramento County in 1980. I'm not sure if it's the one in Citrus Heights that JJD was arrested at. I didn't come by a sale of property after that purchase, just a title change where Sharon's name was dropped from the deed. So someone was still living in that house during the SoCal murder sprees. Perhaps Joe would be going to SoCal to visit Sharon or his brother, John, or his mother, and while there he commited his crimes.

Right you are, lots of information will be coming out and it's hard to know at this point in time which things are facts and which things are opinions or educated guesses. 

I've heard that they rented out the Citrus Heights home but was that just a guess based on the fact his daughter was born in L.A?  Because around that time he bought a gun in Whittier?  Maybe his wife went into labor while visiting relatives. 

There are missing years between when he was fired and when he became employed at SaveMart.  I understand he worked as a handyman.  Immediately I think of the guy that installed the mirror at Janelle's home shortly before she was murdered.  Handyman?...I wonder if he advertised?  Did he have an add in the paper, the phone book?  Was he licensed?  Did he use his real name or a generic name like "Busy Bee Handyman service" and just tell people his first name.  

In the meantime I'm anxiously awaiting any little bit of information that is released but realizing we have to be careful of the source and is it accurate.

[tongue]

Jun 12, 2018 5:15:22 GMT defensorfortis said:

Are you serious? What were they really right about?

When has a profiler ever helped anyone SOLVE anything?

Profiling is 95% make believe garbage and the other 5% of it that has "value" just amounts to the statement of obvious things.

The FBI's best profilers believed the Unibomber was an uneducated working class airline mechanic. They couldn't have been more wrong.

I believe that any literate person could read 'Sudden Terror' or 'Hunting a Psychopath' and compose their own "profile" of the offender that was as good of a fit for D'Angelo, or better, than anything created by a professional profiler.

Amen..the basic profile I had turned out to be right in many areas as well and I was just using common sense for the most part..it's interesting FBI profilers are like psychics in that their fans only generally look at the things they get Right! Discard the rest..

  I'm surprised people make their living giving these profiles that have no actual use in catching or finding the offender

[Deleted]

Jun 15, 2018 18:06:46 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

In the meantime I'm anxiously awaiting any little bit of information that is released but realizing we have to be careful of the source and is it accurate.

Right, where can these bits of info be obtained? Seems like this message board is not dispensing a lot of good info like it used to, although that could be because there is not much info to dispense right now. Can you recommend any other website with timely info?

[cleopatra]

Jun 15, 2018 19:11:55 GMT @endoftheworld said:

Jun 15, 2018 18:06:46 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

In the meantime I'm anxiously awaiting any little bit of information that is released but realizing we have to be careful of the source and is it accurate.

Right, where can these bits of info be obtained? Seems like this message board is not dispensing a lot of good info like it used to, although that could be because there is not much info to dispense right now. Can you recommend any other website with timely info?

Actually, this is the only site and board I use.  I only see what's on Reddit when a link is posted here.

Another thing I've thought about is that the D'Ambrosia profile stated that the offender's job may have brought him to the areas where the murders took place and that the offender may have lived or worked in Ventura.  After JJD was fired and found guilty I court for shoplifting, he may have had difficulty finding employment.  There has been speculation that he worked for his brother and/or his stepfather.  What if he did continue to reside in NorCal, but one or both of them hired him to help them with certain jobs in SoCal, and that's what brought him there? 

LE should see if JJD's brother or stepfather's companies had any jobs going on during the times of each murder.

[cleopatra]

Jun 11, 2018 3:06:44 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

 FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole, and FDLE profiler, Leslie D'Ambrosia.
All of the following was said by them before he was caught, it comes from Unmasking a Killer and that program was completed and in the can in 2017.

D'Ambrosia said, "he's alive and he is among us!"

D'Ambrosia said, "It's my opinion the Visalia Ransacker is the East Area Rapist who became the Golden State Killer"

D'Ambrosia: "This guy is not going to want to stop so I don't believe he would have stopped. He would need to do something that was satisfying to him."

Seems that O'Toole is disagreeing with D'Ambrosia here. She said "We know he was gratified by murder but that doesn't mean he isn't satisfying his urges and desires in other ways. The ligatures followed him through his sexual assaults and followed him through the murders and because of that behavior following him for that period of time, I think that's one of his strongest paraphilic behaviors."

D'Ambrosia: "So today I would expect to see bondage with his relationships. Perhaps he has a compliant partner engaging in bondage."
(Hmmm? Is that why Bonnie, the girlfriend, broke up with him? There undoubtedly were many reasons to break up with him before it could have gotten to that point though.)  

D'Ambrosia: "I firmly believe there are people out there who knows who he is"

D'Ambrosia: I think there are women who dated or married him who say, "you know, I think he might be the guy."

O'Toole said "To demonstrate that level of violence, it has to in part come from his family home." She said there was sexual pathology and violence in that family. She said some paraphilic behavior happened to him as a little boy. IT COULD BE HE WITNESSED IT. He could have been sexually molested OR A SIBLING.
(as a 10 y.o. he witnessed his 7 y.o. sister being raped according to what this sister told her son/his cousin, and it has been reported his real father beat his mother.)

O'Toole: "It's very likely we do not know all of his crimes."

O'Toole: Is sure he would have kept his trophies to this day. She said that even if he knows if they are found it could put him on death row, he'll keep them" . And she said he may have gifted jewelry etc. to a girlfriend or wife and get pleasure from seeing her wear it.

D'Ambrosia doesn't seem to be so sure, she says he was into self preservation. (I'm not sure if that statement was indicating she thinks perhaps he would not have kept the trophies. I think that's what she means but it's not crystal clear.)

ROY HAZELWOOD, Profiler (another case with parallels to this case):

Roy Hazelwood said “peepers” choose victims of opportunity”! And he said they probably live within a few blocks.
(note: Hazelwood is talking about peepers and is not mentioning rapists.)
Edmond, Oklahoma, A peeper (Jonathan Graham) entered the house with intent to rape. When he unexpectedly encountered a male in the hallway, he stabbed him to death. He then proceeded to raped the woman.
Hazelwood's Profile: Age 22 to 27, Education: hi school graduate.

Hazelwood said the KILLERS WEIGHT WOULD FLUCTUATE, would have been traumatized from unexpectedly killing a person. Hazelwood said the perpetrator would look for a LEGITIMATE REASON TO LEAVE TOWN.
As Hazelwood predicted Graham did lose weight after the crime and found an excuse to leave town -- he joined the army.

NOTE the similarity: DeAngelo, did find an excuse to leave Visalia after the McGowen shooting, a change of jobs.
                              DeAngelo did lose weight which threw everyone off because of the discrepancy between the pudgy Ransacker and the thin EAR.

I've been trying without success to find another article about a profiler that said serial rapists tend to travel great distances.  I am now seeing how that ties into DeAngelo too.  He lived in Auburn and traveled to Contra Costa County, Stockton, Modesto, San Jose and So. California all while living in Auburn.  (There is an indication that at some point they did live in Los Angeles as their second daughter was born there in November 1986.)

This is from recollection, so I could be wrong.  The Riverside Killer said he moved his crimes to farther away areas to throw off LE.

DeAngelo had "evidence collecting" knowledge.  He would have known LE would have been trying to find common denominators.  He would have known they would been looking for a suspect who lived near his first attacks.  He would have known LE would put together suspect descriptions from each crime.  He changed his appearance, he kept his mask on, he attacked far from his residence, he disguised the way he talked. 

JJD knew that by throwing out lots of red herrings, there would be a lot of false leads and clues being analyzed.  JJD knew LE would be asking neighbors if they saw any unfamiliar cars in the area recently, so he probably used stolen cars and never one of his own or that of a family member.  JJD wouldn't have wanted a family member to read in the papers that a car like theirs was seen near an EAR attack while JJD was borrowing their car.  JJD knew all those crime areas outside of Greater Sac were under different LE jurisdictions, so he attacked in  those areas, nearby freeway ramps, but never more than twice in one area.

There was a time when board members here argued about "this possibly  being a red herring" and "that possible being a red herring".  I once said, "Well, they can't ALL be red herrings!"  But now I feel differently.  And it was because of ALL those red herrings that JJD eluded LE for so long.  Everyone was looking for a developer's employee, a contractor or construction worker, a pilot, a real estate agent, someone who had a 6th grade teacher that let him down, a guy with a stutter, a guy who spoke through clenched teeth, a guy with a bull tattoo on his arm, a guy who was somewhat developmentally delayed, a guy with a high-pitched voice, a guy who lived nearby the first few Rancho Cordova attacks.

[Deleted]

Jun 16, 2018 1:50:09 GMT cleopatra said:

Jun 11, 2018 3:06:44 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

 FBI profiler Mary Ellen O'Toole, and FDLE profiler, Leslie D'Ambrosia.
All of the following was said by them before he was caught, it comes from Unmasking a Killer and that program was completed and in the can in 2017.

D'Ambrosia said, "he's alive and he is among us!"

D'Ambrosia said, "It's my opinion the Visalia Ransacker is the East Area Rapist who became the Golden State Killer"

D'Ambrosia: "This guy is not going to want to stop so I don't believe he would have stopped. He would need to do something that was satisfying to him."

Seems that O'Toole is disagreeing with D'Ambrosia here. She said "We know he was gratified by murder but that doesn't mean he isn't satisfying his urges and desires in other ways. The ligatures followed him through his sexual assaults and followed him through the murders and because of that behavior following him for that period of time, I think that's one of his strongest paraphilic behaviors."

D'Ambrosia: "So today I would expect to see bondage with his relationships. Perhaps he has a compliant partner engaging in bondage."
(Hmmm? Is that why Bonnie, the girlfriend, broke up with him? There undoubtedly were many reasons to break up with him before it could have gotten to that point though.)  

D'Ambrosia: "I firmly believe there are people out there who knows who he is"

D'Ambrosia: I think there are women who dated or married him who say, "you know, I think he might be the guy."

O'Toole said "To demonstrate that level of violence, it has to in part come from his family home." She said there was sexual pathology and violence in that family. She said some paraphilic behavior happened to him as a little boy. IT COULD BE HE WITNESSED IT. He could have been sexually molested OR A SIBLING.
(as a 10 y.o. he witnessed his 7 y.o. sister being raped according to what this sister told her son/his cousin, and it has been reported his real father beat his mother.)

O'Toole: "It's very likely we do not know all of his crimes."

O'Toole: Is sure he would have kept his trophies to this day. She said that even if he knows if they are found it could put him on death row, he'll keep them" . And she said he may have gifted jewelry etc. to a girlfriend or wife and get pleasure from seeing her wear it.

D'Ambrosia doesn't seem to be so sure, she says he was into self preservation. (I'm not sure if that statement was indicating she thinks perhaps he would not have kept the trophies. I think that's what she means but it's not crystal clear.)

ROY HAZELWOOD, Profiler (another case with parallels to this case):

Roy Hazelwood said “peepers” choose victims of opportunity”! And he said they probably live within a few blocks.
(note: Hazelwood is talking about peepers and is not mentioning rapists.)
Edmond, Oklahoma, A peeper (Jonathan Graham) entered the house with intent to rape. When he unexpectedly encountered a male in the hallway, he stabbed him to death. He then proceeded to raped the woman.
Hazelwood's Profile: Age 22 to 27, Education: hi school graduate.

Hazelwood said the KILLERS WEIGHT WOULD FLUCTUATE, would have been traumatized from unexpectedly killing a person. Hazelwood said the perpetrator would look for a LEGITIMATE REASON TO LEAVE TOWN.
As Hazelwood predicted Graham did lose weight after the crime and found an excuse to leave town -- he joined the army.

NOTE the similarity: DeAngelo, did find an excuse to leave Visalia after the McGowen shooting, a change of jobs.
                              DeAngelo did lose weight which threw everyone off because of the discrepancy between the pudgy Ransacker and the thin EAR.

I've been trying without success to find another article about a profiler that said serial rapists tend to travel great distances.  I am now seeing how that ties into DeAngelo too.  He lived in Auburn and traveled to Contra Costa County, Stockton, Modesto, San Jose and So. California all while living in Auburn.  (There is an indication that at some point they did live in Los Angeles as their second daughter was born there in November 1986.)

This is from recollection, so I could be wrong.  The Riverside Killer said he moved his crimes to farther away areas to throw off LE.

DeAngelo had "evidence collecting" knowledge.  He would have known LE would have been trying to find common denominators.  He would have known they would been looking for a suspect who lived near his first attacks.  He would have known LE would put together suspects description from each crime.  He changed his appearance, he kept his mask on, he attacked far from his residence, he disguised the way he talked.  He knew that by throwing out lots of red herrings, there would be a lot of false leads and clues to be analyzed.  He knew LE would be asking neighbors if they saw any unfamiliar cars in the area recently, so he probably used stolen cars and never one of his own or that of a family member.  He wouldn't want a family member to read in the papers that a car like theirs was seen near an EAR attack while he was borrowing their car.  He knew all those crime areas outside of Greater Sac were under different LE jurisdictions, so he attacked at those places, nearby freeway ramps, but never more than twice in one area.

There was a time when board members here argued about this possible red herring and that possible red herring.  I once said, "Well, they can't ALL be red herring!"  But now I feel differently.  And it was because of ALL those red herrings that JJD eluded LE for so long.  Everyone was looking for a developer's employee, a contractor or construction worker, a pilot, a real estate agent, someone who had a 6th grade teacher that let him down, a guy with a stutter, a guy who spoke through clenched teeth, a guy with a bull tattoo on his arm, a guy who was somewhat developmentally delayed, a guy with a high-pitched voice. 

Also, there could be an accomplice and/or copycats in some of the rapes. What about the pot belly in a couple rapes? How did he "red herring" that?

[cleopatra]

Jun 16, 2018 1:54:41 GMT @endoftheworld said:

Jun 16, 2018 1:50:09 GMT cleopatra said:

This is from recollection, so I could be wrong.  The Riverside Killer said he moved his crimes to farther away areas to throw off LE.

DeAngelo had "evidence collecting" knowledge.  He would have known LE would have been trying to find common denominators.  He would have known they would been looking for a suspect who lived near his first attacks.  He would have known LE would put together suspects description from each crime.  He changed his appearance, he kept his mask on, he attacked far from his residence, he disguised the way he talked.  He knew that by throwing out lots of red herrings, there would be a lot of false leads and clues to be analyzed.  He knew LE would be asking neighbors if they saw any unfamiliar cars in the area recently, so he probably used stolen cars and never one of his own or that of a family member.  He wouldn't want a family member to read in the papers that a car like theirs was seen near an EAR attack while he was borrowing their car.  He knew all those crime areas outside of Greater Sac were under different LE jurisdictions, so he attacked at those places, nearby freeway ramps, but never more than twice in one area.

There was a time when board members here argued about this possible red herring and that possible red herring.  I once said, "Well, they can't ALL be red herring!"  But now I feel differently.  And it was because of ALL those red herrings that JJD eluded LE for so long.  Everyone was looking for a developer's employee, a contractor or construction worker, a pilot, a real estate agent, someone who had a 6th grade teacher that let him down, a guy with a stutter, a guy who spoke through clenched teeth, a guy with a bull tattoo on his arm, a guy who was somewhat developmentally delayed, a guy with a high-pitched voice. 

Also, there could be an accomplice and/or copycats in some of the rapes. What about the pot belly in a couple rapes? How did he "red herring" that?

You are absolutely right!  I always believed that some of the rapes attributed to the EAR were actually committed by copycats.  Like the one where the attacker had a pot belly, as you mentioned.   And like the one where the mother fought the EAR tooth and nail and she got away.  Also, the ones that did not take place in one story houses.   I could be wrong though, but that's still my opinion.

[cleopatra]

Jun 15, 2018 18:06:46 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

Jun 15, 2018 17:38:41 GMT cleopatra said:

We know for a fact the baby was born there. That doesn't necessarily mean they lived there.

I have three sisters. I am the second child. All of my sisters were born in San Francisco. I was not born in the State of California. My mother and sister who is a year older than me were staying with my aunt (my mom's older sister) while my father was on a business assignment in Europe. If my father were not out of town and so far away, I'd have been born in San Francisco.

Joseph and Sharon Huddle bought a home using a VA loan in Sacramento County in 1980. I'm not sure if it's the one in Citrus Heights that JJD was arrested at. I didn't come by a sale of property after that purchase, just a title change where Sharon's name was dropped from the deed. So someone was still living in that house during the SoCal murder sprees. Perhaps Joe would be going to SoCal to visit Sharon or his brother, John, or his mother, and while there he commited his crimes.

Right you are, lots of information will be coming out and it's hard to know at this point in time which things are facts and which things are opinions or educated guesses. 

I've heard that they rented out the Citrus Heights home but was that just a guess based on the fact his daughter was born in L.A?  Because around that time he bought a gun in Whittier?  Maybe his wife went into labor while visiting relatives. 

There are missing years between when he was fired and when he became employed at SaveMart.  I understand he worked as a handyman.  Immediately I think of the guy that installed the mirror at Janelle's home shortly before she was murdered.  Handyman?...I wonder if he advertised?  Did he have an add in the paper, the phone book?  Was he licensed?  Did he use his real name or a generic name like "Busy Bee Handyman service" and just tell people his first name.  

In the meantime I'm anxiously awaiting any little bit of information that is released but realizing we have to be careful of the source and is it accurate.

Morf, everyone missed for a reason. JJD knew what reasons LE and anyone else would need to look where they would look. So he created the opposite clues. D'Ambrosia got that one right- the offender had knowledge in evidence collection.

[Agent99 aka Sandia]

Jun 15, 2018 19:11:55 GMT @endoftheworld said:

Jun 15, 2018 18:06:46 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

In the meantime I'm anxiously awaiting any little bit of information that is released but realizing we have to be careful of the source and is it accurate.

Right, where can these bits of info be obtained? Seems like this message board is not dispensing a lot of good info like it used to, although that could be because there is not much info to dispense right now. Can you recommend any other website with timely info?

I do think LE is trying to not talk about the case much now because of the upcoming trial but here are some places I've checked out.

First if you google his name or Golden State Killer new information might come up. 

www.sacsheriff.com/

Sacramento fox40 has a program "Exposed"  that they update fox40.com/2018/02/17/exposed-listen-to-the-full-podcast/

Debi Domingo's Facebook page.  www.facebook.com/search/top/?q=debbi%20domingo-mcmullan

www.facebook.com/search/str/rest+in+peace+janelle+lisa+cruz/keywords_search

Jennifer Carole, the daughter of Lyman Smith has a wonderful blog. /http://jcarole.com

Criminology podcast has had some really good interviews.  criminology.libsyn.com/

Of course the proboards and reddit

This is a link for upcoming court dates:  services.saccourt.ca.gov/PublicCaseAccess/Criminal/CaseDetails?sourceSystemId=8&sourceKey=1608381

There was a podcast that seems to have been taken down.  I hope temporarily.  The name is 12-26-75.  They believe there was some cover up in Exeter/Visalia and that DeAngelo killed two teens, Jennifer Armour and Donna Richmond.  They have some really interesting points to make but others say they have a lot of facts wrong.  I don't know if they do or not, the jury is out for me on that.  I see some sticking points for me in motive and timeline but at this point I'm open minded and very interested in what they have to say.  They state they took it down because they don't have time to debate the points.  I wish they would leave up their podcast and just disable comments if that is how they feel.  Anyway it's interesting.