Was JJD also the Early Morning and Early Bird Rapists?

[sammyt]

Now we know a bit more about Joe DeAngelo (and know he was an older offender) isn't it likely that JJD was also the EMR and EBR?


One poster has already mentioned this in some depth, and the more I've thought about it, the more I've found myself considering the idea.


EAR disappeared without a trace in 1979... until he was linked by DNA to the ONS murders.



EMR disappeared without a trace... apparently there wasn't any DNA to compare with future crimes, but the prime suspect was never linked to anything else.


EMR was an older, stocky offender with receding hair and a hatred of the Sac. Sheriffs (sounds like anyone we know???) so for most, this 'ruled him out' as the slim, young and long haired EAR.


EBR disappeared without a trace... again no DNA and again a prime suspect who was never linked to anything else.



What are the odds that two other extremely prolific rapists (each with 35+ victims) are just able to stop? We know that DeAngelo wasn't.



If 'Montana' and the 'VIP's son' were identified correctly, then they seemingly either managed to quit cold turkey, or changed MO without ever being suspected or linked, let alone charged, with any future crimes.



As far as I know, both suspects were able to live 'normal' lives. The 'VIP's son' would have been an extremely precocious, young rapist, yet must have just quit offending way before the sort of 30+ age caught rapists such as EAR (still feels surreal but great saying that ) are known to slow down.



I don't buy it.  Two serial rapists who disappear just before EAR emerges.  Never to emerge or offend again.


********EDIT*********
It seems like the EBR ('VIP's son') may have committed 'only' 5 rapes, not 35+ rapes.  He may also have later been convicted of two rapes, which would make him a much better EBR suspect than my original post suggests.

Sorry for the misinfo, but the EBR/EMR case is a hot, confusing mess, and to add to the mess most of the police records etc have been thrown away.

This all still leaves a 30ish, stocky, receding, copycat serial rapist who struck around 40 times between 72-76 and had many similarities and some differences with EAR.

[faser41]

EBR=early bird rapist and EMR= early morning rapist, correct? When googled, both bring up ear/ons/DeAngelo etc..., while one link goes to reddit........did both these serial rapists prey upon the greater Sacto region as did jjd? Did these two psychos come along after or before the EAR?

[sammyt]

Nov 25, 2018 20:20:03 GMT faser41 said:

EBR=early bird rapist and EMR= early morning rapist, correct? When googled, both bring up ear/ons/DeAngelo etc..., while one link goes to reddit........did both these serial rapists prey upon the greater Sacto region as did jjd? Did these two psychos come along after or before the EAR?

Yep that's correct about the names.  I don't know if the locations they offended in were in greater Sac...

These two uncaught rapists were active in the early-mid 70s.  They stopped just before EAR started offending in 1976.

To add to the general confusion, there have been other (captured) serial rapists with the same EMR and EBR monikers.

[faser41]

Thanks Sammyt I had heard of those acronyms for rapists also....in fact i had previously thought EBR stood for east bay rapist, which would make sense for anybody from the Bay Area. 

[almagata]

Nov 25, 2018 19:47:50 GMT sammyt said:

Now we know a bit more about Joe DeAngelo (and know he was an older offender) isn't it likely that JJD was also the EMR and EBR?


One poster has already mentioned this in some depth, and the more I've thought about it, the more I've found myself considering the idea.


EAR disappeared without a trace in 1979... until he was linked by DNA to the ONS murders.



EMR disappeared without a trace... apparently there wasn't any DNA to compare with future crimes, but the prime suspect was never linked to anything else.


EMR was an older, stocky offender with receding hair and a hatred of the Sac. Sheriffs (sounds like anyone we know???) so for most, this 'ruled him out' as the slim, young and long haired EAR.


EBR disappeared without a trace... again no DNA and again a prime suspect who was never linked to anything else.



What are the odds that two other extremely prolific rapists (each with 35+ victims) are just able to stop? We know that DeAngelo wasn't.



If 'Montana' and the 'VIP's son' were identified correctly, then they seemingly either managed to quit cold turkey, or changed MO without ever being suspected or linked, let alone charged, with any future crimes.



As far as I know, both suspects were able to live 'normal' lives. The 'VIP's son' would have been an extremely precocious, young rapist, yet must have just quit offending way before the sort of 30+ age caught rapists such as EAR (still feels surreal but great saying that ) are known to slow down.



I don't buy it.  Two serial rapists who disappear just before EAR emerges.  Never to emerge or offend again.

I would say it certainly is possible.  JJD knew how to make it look like a different offender by changing his behavior during an attack. 

[nocomment]

In hindsight, I don’t find either Shelby or Crompton’s theories on EBR/EMR to be probable. It would be interesting to know if their opinions have changed, as they lived through those cases. We have such limited information, we can’t really make informed opinions. It’s interesting that no main stream media has touched on this, although LE has probably revisited it since the arrest.

IMO JJD was either familiar with these offenders and emulating some of their methods, or he was them.

[looking4justice]

Sammy can you post the composites for the EMR & EBR in this thread? I think folks will be interested to see the resemblance to an early JJD portrait

[almagata]

Nov 27, 2018 5:21:44 GMT looking4justice said:

Sammy can you post the composites for the EMR & EBR in this thread? I think folks will be interested to see the resemblance to an early JJD portrait

Here is a composite for the Early Morning Rapist.   I don't know if I ever had a composite for the  Early Bird Rapist.  Portoflieth had compiled the composites for EMR and EAR and posted it in the past showing the similarities.    

Attachments:

[nick]

I personally think of them as three separate offenders if you really look at the case files the MO is different for each in a few different ways with that and their distinctive victimology. Just my opinion.

[Deleted]

What do you think about the other ones, the Cordova cat burglar, the Cordova meadows burglar and the Cordova flasher? These are the creeps that I think are JJD.

[sammyt]

Nov 27, 2018 7:29:02 GMT nick said:

I personally think of them as three separate offenders if you really look at the case files the MO is different for each in a few different ways with that and their distinctive victimology. Just my opinion.

That's very possible, and I haven't seen the case files for the EMR/EBR series, but lots of people thought for years that EAR and VR were separate offenders... and lots thought the same about ONS and EAR...

The EMR composite looks a lot like JJD to me (JMO though) and I find it suspicious that such a rapist disappeared into thin air just before EAR emerged.

JJD was versatile in terms of MO and victimology, and seems to have already been active in 1973 in non EAR or VR type crimes, so who knows...?

[Deleted]

Nov 27, 2018 11:12:54 GMT sammyt said:

Nov 27, 2018 7:29:02 GMT nick said:

I personally think of them as three separate offenders if you really look at the case files the MO is different for each in a few different ways with that and their distinctive victimology. Just my opinion.

That's very possible, and I haven't seen the case files for the EMR/EBR series, but lots of people thought for years that EAR and VR were separate offenders... and lots thought the same about ONS and EAR...

The EMR composite looks a lot like JJD to me (JMO though) and I find it suspicious that such a rapist disappeared into thin air just before EAR emerged.

JJD was versatile in terms of MO and victimology, and seems to have already been active in 1973 in non EAR or VR type crimes, so who knows...?

Shelby talked about this a little in one of his podcasts. Of course, we all get these three mixed up because of the similarity of the initials used, but one of these guys, according to Shelby, raped always in apartments, whereas JJD raped at suburban homes. And, of course, Shelby thought it was their main suspect who escaped to Montana. This is something I don't exactly understand. You mean he could not be captured in Montana and brought back to CA to face RAPE charges?

That all said, sure it is possible JJD was the same guy. We will probably never find out since the SOL is long gone.

[trabuco]

Nov 27, 2018 6:51:19 GMT almagata said:

Nov 27, 2018 5:21:44 GMT looking4justice said:

Sammy can you post the composites for the EMR & EBR in this thread? I think folks will be interested to see the resemblance to an early JJD portrait

Here is a composite for the Early Morning Rapist.   I don't know if I ever had a composite for the  Early Bird Rapist.  Portoflieth had compiled the composites for EMR and EAR and posted it in the past showing the similarities.    

this composite looks similar to the EAR composite who was chased by Rod Miller.

[trabuco]

I think the morning bird could have been the EAR as well. He came to Sacramento and hit the ground running.

Shelby said a judge offered to sign a warrant to pick up the early bird or early morning rapist but Shelby declined fearing he didn't have enough evidence to hold and / or prosecute him. When I read that I had to read it again to make sure I didn't get it wrong. My thought was if you arrest him and the rapes stop, well then.

[trabuco]

Nov 27, 2018 7:29:02 GMT nick said:

I personally think of them as three separate offenders if you really look at the case files the MO is different for each in a few different ways with that and their distinctive victimology. Just my opinion.

case files? I dream of having case files. Being privy to the information in case files. But I don't and won't ever have them. I accept that fact. That is why I am just your average everyday sleuther. I'm okay with that too.