DeAngelo flew

[johnnyhands1]

Jul 18, 2020 3:18:39 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

Jul 17, 2020 23:46:25 GMT cherylh said:

The "Barefoot Bandit" and his plane stealing: That the kid stole planes is what got him noticed, what made him famous. What started an international manhunt to catch him. Otherwise he would have been a kid who committed burglaries and other small-time crimes and no one would have heard of him. Stealing planes is a good attention grabber.

JJD, driving a car, could move around mostly unnoticed. And if he was noticed, he had his status as a police officer to allay suspicion.

But if he's been linked to a stolen plane, there would have been no way to explain his way out of it. He'd be in big trouble.

Yet again it should be noted that we're talking about distances easily traveled by car and motorcycle.

As others have stated, not every little report and "clue" that came up before he was identified has turned out to have meaning and be significant. The footprints "leading" to an airport might have been unrelated. And they might not have even been related to the airport. The guy who took a cab -- he was almost surely somebody who had nothing to do with the crimes. The paint chips could have been from any number of things.

This isn't a crime novel in which everything is there for a reason. You don't have to find a way to work everything that was brought up over the years into the final picture. A lot of irrelevant and random things got tossed into the "evidence" pile before the real answer was revealed.

Everyone is entitled to have their own theories and opinions.  I'd like to point out a couple of differences from my scenario: 

The barefoot bandit didn't return the planes he stole.

He crash landed them.  

Yes, indeed, the barefoot bandit did gain attention and notoriety not to mention the pictures he took of himself and the other stunts he pulled like leaving behind 39 footprints in chalk with the writing c'ya! and that fact he was a teenager.

For comments from others:  I'm not saying he bought a ticket and flew on a commercial airline.  I'm saying he stole a private plane from a private airport and returned it.  It wouldn't even matter if it was discovered the plane had been taken.  It was back.  Would the police even believe the person.  What were they to do if the plane had been returned?  That is, if it was even noticed to have been taken.

#1 DeAngelo knew how to fly  #2 the Modesto/Davis situation  #3 the distances he traveled back and forth from Citrus Heights to Goleta, Ventura, Orange County not to mention the number of trips to do reconnaissance and planning.

Do airplanes (or did airplanes of that era) have some kind of odometer system. If so, did pilots routinely log those miles in their flight log.  Sorry if this is a dumb question.

[Agent99 aka Sandia]

Jul 18, 2020 4:18:29 GMT johnnyhands1 said:

Jul 18, 2020 3:18:39 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

Everyone is entitled to have their own theories and opinions.  I'd like to point out a couple of differences from my scenario: 

The barefoot bandit didn't return the planes he stole.

He crash landed them.  

Yes, indeed, the barefoot bandit did gain attention and notoriety not to mention the pictures he took of himself and the other stunts he pulled like leaving behind 39 footprints in chalk with the writing c'ya! and that fact he was a teenager.

For comments from others:  I'm not saying he bought a ticket and flew on a commercial airline.  I'm saying he stole a private plane from a private airport and returned it.  It wouldn't even matter if it was discovered the plane had been taken.  It was back.  Would the police even believe the person.  What were they to do if the plane had been returned?  That is, if it was even noticed to have been taken.

#1 DeAngelo knew how to fly  #2 the Modesto/Davis situation  #3 the distances he traveled back and forth from Citrus Heights to Goleta, Ventura, Orange County not to mention the number of trips to do reconnaissance and planning.

Do airplanes (or did airplanes of that era) have some kind of odometer system. If so, did pilots routinely log those miles in their flight log.  Sorry if this is a dumb question.

No, Johnny but they had a Hobbs meter which was a different system.  

[johnnyhands1]

Jul 18, 2020 5:43:55 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

Jul 18, 2020 4:18:29 GMT johnnyhands1 said:

Do airplanes (or did airplanes of that era) have some kind of odometer system. If so, did pilots routinely log those miles in their flight log.  Sorry if this is a dumb question.

No, Johnny but they had a Hobbs meter which was a different system.  

But it measured miles flown, and could be easily read by a pilot for logging purposes?

[michravera]

Jul 18, 2020 6:44:27 GMT johnnyhands1 said:

Jul 18, 2020 5:43:55 GMT Agent99 aka Sandia said:

No, Johnny but they had a Hobbs meter which was a different system.  

But it measured miles flown, and could be easily read by a pilot for logging purposes?

One meter measures the time during which the plane has oil pressure. The other counts revolutions of the engine. These are both surrogate for "flying time". Either can be used for counting your flying hours. Apart from making sure that you have at least one or two flights of a particular length, all experience in aviation is measured in "hours". Some pilots like to fly blimps in order to build their flight hours without using a lot of fuel and without going very far. As a private pilot, I get the same credit flying a Cessna 172 from San Jose to Sacramento as a Airline captain does for flying a Boeing 737 from San Jose to Los Angeles. If the Cessna were a twin (and didn't go much faster than the 172), we'd even both log the time as "Multi".  Our only difference would be "Time in Type".

[V]

Jul 18, 2020 8:10:30 GMT michravera said:

Jul 18, 2020 6:44:27 GMT johnnyhands1 said:

But it measured miles flown, and could be easily read by a pilot for logging purposes?

One meter measures the time during which the plane has oil pressure. The other counts revolutions of the engine. These are both surrogate for "flying time". Either can be used for counting your flying hours. Apart from making sure that you have at least one or two flights of a particular length, all experience in aviation is measured in "hours". Some pilots like to fly blimps in order to build their flight hours without using a lot of fuel and without going very far. As a private pilot, I get the same credit flying a Cessna 172 from San Jose to Sacramento as a Airline captain does for flying a Boeing 737 from San Jose to Los Angeles. If the Cessna were a twin (and didn't go much faster than the 172), we'd even both log the time as "Multi".  Our only difference would be "Time in Type".

That seems sort of ridiculous. You would think a much larger plane would count for more XP.  

[drewogatory]

"#2 the Modesto/Davis situation"

Next time I'm home I'll drive the route I think JJD might have taken (113 South) and I'll come back up the 5 towards Sac, in case he used that route. I'll time it and post it, but it's not a long or taxing drive. I used to have a girlfriend in Stockton (which is like 75% of the way to Modesto from Davis) and I'd drive down, pick her up, drive back to Davis and then bring her home so she could work. I'd do that like 3 days a week.

[michravera]

Jul 18, 2020 22:05:13 GMT drewogatory said:

"#2 the Modesto/Davis situation"

Next time I'm home I'll drive the route I think JJD might have taken (113 South) and I'll come back up the 5 towards Sac, in case he used that route. I'll time it and post it, but it's not a long or taxing drive. I used to have a girlfriend in Stockton (which is like 75% of the way to Modesto from Davis) and I'd drive down, pick her up, drive back to Davis and then bring her home so she could work. I'd do that like 3 days a week.

Remember to take CASR-99 when you drive it. I-5 didn't open all of the way to Stockton (It ended at Hood-Franklin Rd) until about 1980. I am not sure that CASR-99 was 100% freeway to Stockton and Modesto at that time either, but we are talking about 10 extra minutes at the most. And the posted speed limit would have been 55MPH between Sacramento and Stockton, not 70MPH. My estimate is that this was about a 2 hour drive each way and probably about a 2 hour round trip flight. You'd certainly save time flying, but only if you had a plane ready to go at both ends. Give me 26 hours (as the times of the crimes are reported) and even bicycling wouldn't have been out of the question.

[drewogatory]

Google says it's 91.5 miles and 94 minutes. That's 113 to 12 to 99. Hardly an obstacle. Folks act like he was driving back and forth to San Diego. From my house in Davis I could be in Santa Monica in under 6 hours if I timed it right. Modesto is nothing.

[cherylh]

We know he had cars and a motorcycle. We know he liked long drives, back roads -- and excessive speeds.

We know he wasn't spending much time with his wife.

[drewogatory]

Jul 19, 2020 2:10:23 GMT cherylh said:

We know he had cars and a motorcycle. We know he liked long drives, back roads -- and excessive speeds.

We know he wasn't spending much time with his wife.

And this is a pretty good back road for the region. And it wasn't really as much of a back road back then, the back gate of Travis AFB opened out that way for instance. And a bunch of agricultural traffic. Vacaville had onions, Dixon had meat, Woodland had tomatoes and rice, Rio Vista had a bridge, Winters had almonds, etc. You could truck that stuff straight south without hitching up to Sac. I've spent many,many an hour driving those roads. Even today they are still pretty sparse, but not like when everything was so much more spread out.

[Agent99 aka Sandia]

Jul 18, 2020 22:05:13 GMT drewogatory said:

"#2 the Modesto/Davis situation"

Next time I'm home I'll drive the route I think JJD might have taken (113 South) and I'll come back up the 5 towards Sac, in case he used that route. I'll time it and post it, but it's not a long or taxing drive. I used to have a girlfriend in Stockton (which is like 75% of the way to Modesto from Davis) and I'd drive down, pick her up, drive back to Davis and then bring her home so she could work. I'd do that like 3 days a week.

It's the combination of things.  The distance between Modesto and Davis being the least of it. 

It's the footprints leading to the U C Davis airport from the victim's home. 

It's the taxi driver picking up the fare from the Modesto airport and the weird place he dropped him off and the attack that night being 1/2 mile away. 

It's that he knew how to fly.

The distances I'm talking about are from Citrus Heights to Goleta,  Ventura  not just for the murders themselves but there are reports of break-in's, dog stabbings and many activities that probably were him.  We know that was his M. O. to do surveillance and planning no doubt choosing alternate victims etc.  This would have required multiple trips.

[dougguard]

You guys understand the airport belongs to U.C Davis for U.C. Purposes and has never been a general aviation airport. Perhaps it’s mission has changed but not in the years of the offenses. If any of you posters have different info? Please correct me.

[steelbike]

The lull in Ransacking cannot be explained by an academic calendar. I would love to know what arrests occurred around Nov 3.

Some of the other activities in Visalia around this lull:

Nov 1 Plane stolen at the Redlands airport found at Visalia airport with marijuana traces

Nov 2 A new Mervyn's department store opened

Nov 2 Mendota Canal drained for cleaning

Nov 11 COS Water Polo team wins over San Joaquin Delta for valley title

Nov 12 Theft of 500 pounds of sugar at the Rex Bottling Plant

Nov 15 Lemoore NAS warbirds air show at Castle AFB

Nov 29 Cane Lane Parade announced for Monday, Play Off Game Tomorrow

earonsgsk.proboards.com/post/33327

[drewogatory]

Jul 23, 2020 8:48:34 GMT dougguard said:

You guys understand the airport belongs to U.C Davis for U.C. Purposes and has never been a general aviation airport. Perhaps it’s mission has changed but not in the years of the offenses. If any of you posters have different info? Please correct me.

I mean, this is straight from their website:

The Cal Aggie Flying Farmers, Inc. was established in 1947 and is the oldest general aviation operation in the Sacramento, California area. The Cal Aggies are located at the University Airport, Davis, California, on the University of California Davis campus. The airport is operated as a public airport. The Cal Aggie’s original aircraft operation was started as a non-profit corporation by aviation enthusiasts, local farmers and returning World War II pilots.

The organization is still operating not for profit under its original goal of providing the highest quality flight instruction and aircraft to the general public at a reasonable cost. The University Airport is a small, non-towered airport that provides a friendly aviation environment and a cost savings by reducing ground delays found at larger airports.

[dougguard]

Thank you for the clarification.