Donna Lass found

[mtf65]

Dec 28, 2023 21:40:26 GMT cat2 said:

Dec 28, 2023 16:13:46 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

Agree, with the exception that I think sometimes Joe's crimes were more opportunistic. But he no doubt held grudges and acted on them. Look at Victor Hayes as one example. Also, I believe the day after Bonnie broke up with JJD, there was an unsolved arson on Calwell street. Or some name almost identical to Bonnie's last name. Look at the Daniel Williams case. Home invasion with calls to taunt. And breaking in with such boldness. JJD loved to poison animals. He killed by Proxie. You can clearly see he associates his crimes with revenge. "Bonnie, I hate you" during the middle of a rape. Look at all the matching names. I'm in the camp that believes he could very well be Sandy in 1963. People before me have pointed out all the matching names. See below from a previous poster. In addition to these, there seem to be a lot of Kathleens. Also, 12-26-75 used to have all the critical dates in his life lined up with Zodiac dates. Zodiac letters sent on JJD's birthday, his mother's birthday and his stepfather's birthday. The list goes on and on. It's not coincidence. JJD is Z. Plain as day. Descriptions match perfectly. The timelines line up exactly. I'm very interested to know why 12-26-75 suddenly removed all the JJD and Z information so abruptly.

The commonalities between the cases seem to outweigh statistical averages.

Or the sheer volume of crimes have “randomly” created a number of disturbing coincidences.

Sandy used the Names Bob/ Robert Coffman (name stitched on clothing found in road) and William Carr (name signed at motel.)

Name and geographical patterns between early potential Sandy/Zodiac and later ONS activity.

Vern Smith- Lompoc CA 6/3/63 - Lyman / Charlene Smith ,Ventura 3/13/80

Bob/Robert Coffman (jacket) 6/4/63 - Robert Offerman /Deborah Manning ,Goleta 12/30/79

Domingos/Edwards- Gaviota Beach 6/4/63 - Domingo/Sanchez, Goleta 7/27/81

James Coleman/ JC Reed- Santa Cruz 6/3/63 - Janelle Cruz , Irvine 5/4/86

(Note other JC initials associated with the EAR)

William Carr - Canadian Naval Officer, Author and conspiracy theorist. One of Carr's most-lasting contributions to modern conspiracy theories was his discussion of an alleged plan for three world wars, often referred as the 3WW, which he believed was developed by a Confederate general and Masonic scholar, Albert Pike.

Some other “Loose association”

Burkhart/Harrington-Loomis (near Sierra College) 3/2/77 - Keith/Patti Harrington, Dana Pt 8/19/80

Paul Stine was from Exeter CA

JJD was involved with the International Diving Association and N.A.U.I

(ALA dove in Lake Berryessa prior to Hartnell/Shepherd attack.)

Also Zodiac and EAR asking for “help”, the Belli letter for the Zodiac , multiple calls and rape scenes for EAR.

The Zodiacs obsession with the media and printing his letters, 4/24/78 “movie about me , who will play me..”

Channel Nine letter- “who ever plays me has their work cut out for him.”

EAR has multiple references to TV and the News.

See you in the press or on T.V

Both Zodiac and JJD are putting on a "Performance."

Achieving.......

Should be cause for deserving fame.

Wow, that is a lot of great information. There are a lot more similarities as well. I just haven’t been paying  much attention to this case until Donna was found. I would think that the 12-26-75 site took that information down since they considered it a distraction, as the main purpose of the site is to exonerate Clifton.

i did just watch the 2nd part of the Tony Reid and John Vaughn presentation. At the end Reid states that on the morning DeAngelo was arrested LE interrogated him for 7 hours and they had to stop it since he was confessing to many other crimes. Apparently he wouldn’t stop talking. When will the public have access to that interrogation? It would answer so many questions. He also states that Deangelo refuses to talk to the press or any attorneys.

I remember Trabuco use to say he was hearing Deangelo was confessing to the  Zodiac murders.  Not sure who was telling him that.  The way he said it, he seemed to think he had inside info.

[chrisdesigner1971]

Dec 28, 2023 22:54:42 GMT mustangman said:

Dec 27, 2023 20:56:02 GMT almagata said:

Location tends to indicate someone who has ties to the I80 corridor.  Most people who travel between Sacramento and South Lake Tahoe use Highway 50.  Going around Lake Tahoe adds an hour of travel time.  If someone local to South Lake Tahoe was going to dump a body, there are so many places closer to the casinos that are very remote.  No need to drive to I80 and Highway 20.  

David Faraday and Betty Lou Jensen were murdered on Lake Herman rd very near Lake Herman.
Back in 1968 the turnout was much larger in area and had a double-gated entrance, locked at its center point to guard access to the Benicia Water Pumping Station.

Bryan Hartnell & Cecelia Shepard were attacked at Lake Berryessa.
There is a small power station on this lake near "Devils Gate" at Putah Creek.

Donna Lass disappeared from Lake Tahoe and her skull was found near Lake Spaulding & PG&E Spaulding 1 Powerhouse.

Would I be reading too much into the various coincidence's of attacks very near a lake or that a "water pumping station or power station" are close to (2-3) of these attack/murder sites or where Donna Lass remains were found?  Zodiac uses "Radians" on the Mt. Diablo map, would an engineer who might work at one of these pump/power stations be familiar with "radians"?  He would definately be using maps in his line of work.  I've always suspected that with his knowledge of radians, ciphers or bomb making, that the Zodiac was somewhat well educated and possibly an engineer.  Maybe the location of Donna's remains will shed new light on the killer?  

You hit the nail on the head, with one tweak. And this is something I have been speculating about for a while now. Guess who was a pump diver for PG&E at the time? Joseph James DeAngelo. He would have been familiar, I think, with the waterways and bodies of water because of that. He would have understood how to get there and know the roads like a local. Could have had had access to park a car near the first two attacks and LB? It was always speculated that Z was a local resident because he appeared to know the local roads. But as someone who had reason to travel them for work, could he have made himself very familiar with the area? JJD was a tactical planner. I believe he was doing some work as a welder for his step father, and also freelancing as a pump diver. Remember the Zodiac letter about Scotch tape that mentioned diving fins? Also, with respect to the Lake Berryessa attack, I have often wondered if part of the outfit was welding gear. Look through what welders wore in the late 60s. I'll post some pictures. Also consider that JJD had been a Damage controlman in the Navy. If you take a look at the flash gear they wore, it's striking in context of the outfit he wore at Lake Berryessa. It also shares some with welding head gear, which also uses clip on glasses.

Composits and photos

Flash gear damage controlman wore in the Navy at the time

clip on glasses welders used at the time

Arched text saying Boo and Scary, repeating eyeballs organically arranged

Interesting tidbit about a procedure at the time

Z and crosshatch from Damage control in Navy at the time

More Z, crosshatch and Navy Flash gear

Flash gear

Interesting tidbit from a solve to the Scorpio letter. Looks like DeGroat and Deangelo on the left to me. His parents names combined.

And the Scorpio letter. JJD's bday makes him a Scorpio. This design looks like his boat and the Halloween card.

[mustangman]

Dec 29, 2023 14:38:30 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

Dec 28, 2023 22:54:42 GMT mustangman said:

David Faraday and Betty Lou Jensen were murdered on Lake Herman rd very near Lake Herman.
Back in 1968 the turnout was much larger in area and had a double-gated entrance, locked at its center point to guard access to the Benicia Water Pumping Station.

Bryan Hartnell & Cecelia Shepard were attacked at Lake Berryessa.
There is a small power station on this lake near "Devils Gate" at Putah Creek.

Donna Lass disappeared from Lake Tahoe and her skull was found near Lake Spaulding & PG&E Spaulding 1 Powerhouse.

Would I be reading too much into the various coincidence's of attacks very near a lake or that a "water pumping station or power station" are close to (2-3) of these attack/murder sites or where Donna Lass remains were found?  Zodiac uses "Radians" on the Mt. Diablo map, would an engineer who might work at one of these pump/power stations be familiar with "radians"?  He would definately be using maps in his line of work.  I've always suspected that with his knowledge of radians, ciphers or bomb making, that the Zodiac was somewhat well educated and possibly an engineer.  Maybe the location of Donna's remains will shed new light on the killer?  

You hit the nail on the head, with one tweak. And this is something I have been speculating about for a while now. Guess who was a pump diver for PG&E at the time? Joseph James DeAngelo. He would have been familiar, I think, with the waterways and bodies of water because of that. He would have understood how to get there and know the roads like a local. Could have had had access to park a car near the first two attacks and LB? It was always speculated that Z was a local resident because he appeared to know the local roads. But as someone who had reason to travel them for work, could he have made himself very familiar with the area? JJD was a tactical planner. I believe he was doing some work as a welder for his step father, and also freelancing as a pump diver. Remember the Zodiac letter about Scotch tape that mentioned diving fins? Also, with respect to the Lake Berryessa attack, I have often wondered if part of the outfit was welding gear. Look through what welders wore in the late 60s. I'll post some pictures. Also consider that JJD had been a Damage controlman in the Navy. If you take a look at the flash gear they wore, it's striking in context of the outfit he wore at Lake Berryessa. It also shares some with welding head gear, which also uses clip on glasses.

Composits and photos

Flash gear damage controlman wore in the Navy at the time

clip on glasses welders used at the time

Arched text saying Boo and Scary, repeating eyeballs organically arranged

Interesting tidbit about a procedure at the time

Z and crosshatch from Damage control in Navy at the time

More Z, crosshatch and Navy Flash gear

Flash gear

Interesting tidbit from a solve to the Scorpio letter. Looks like DeGroat and Deangelo on the left to me. His parents names combined.

Deangelo attended a school very near Spaulding Lake (where Donna Lass skull was found) and another in Sacramento, both on route I-80.  The years he attended bookend the Donna Lass disappearance on Sept. 6, 1970.  So at the very least Deanglo was in close proximity, at or around the same time as both the Zodiac murders and Donna lass' disappearance.  Coincidence?? 

+++Beginning in August 1968, DeAngelo attended Sierra College in Rocklin, California; he graduated with an associate degree in police science, with honors.[36] He attended Sacramento State University in 1971, where he earned a bachelor's degree in criminal justice.+++

[mustangman]

Dec 27, 2023 20:56:02 GMT almagata said:

Dec 27, 2023 19:11:40 GMT kg said:

Incredible and awesome.

Given location could this have been an earlier Gerald Gallego victim?

Location tends to indicate someone who has ties to the I80 corridor.  Most people who travel between Sacramento and South Lake Tahoe use Highway 50.  Going around Lake Tahoe adds an hour of travel time.  If someone local to South Lake Tahoe was going to dump a body, there are so many places closer to the casinos that are very remote.  No need to drive to I80 and Highway 20.  

Deangelo attended a school very near Spaulding Lake (where Donna Lass skull was found) and another in Sacramento, both on route I-80. The years he attended bookend the Donna Lass disappearance on Sept. 6, 1970. So at the very least Deanglo was in close proximity, at or around the same time as both the Zodiac murders and Donna lass' disappearance. Coincidence??



+++Beginning in August 1968, DeAngelo attended Sierra College in Rocklin, California; he graduated with an associate degree in police science, with honors.[36] He attended Sacramento State University in 1971, where he earned a bachelor's degree in criminal justice.+++

[chrisdesigner1971]

Very much agree. In fact, various crime sprees of his invariably nicely wrap into life phases and patterns. We see this with his firing from Auburn and his entry as the Original Night Stalker. The only issue with that is while he certainly does kill, rape, prowl in cluster phases, I believe he also does other crimes which overlap. It isn't as clean as linear phases, with clear beginnings and ends. And yes, your inference that his school schedules affected his crimes is spot on. Look at the known Zodiac murders. They all happen on weekends and holidays, which is when a college student would be able to take a short trip out of town in the middle of the night. It all lines up. I am very confused why this Z is JJD idea is so hated. Can anyone exclusively clear him of these crimes? There are others too, that I wonder about, but am less sure of. Such as the Santa Rosa hitchhike murders. The single earrings are an indication. But there is a problem with eye witnesses, if the people in question were actually the perpetrator. But again, the timeline of the phase lines up with what JJD was doing and not doing. Another issue is the Folsom prowler. In April, only days before his arrest. It's almost certainly him. And if it is, which I would be a lot of money on, he has a wig, a fake mole, fake boobs and a bag/kit.

I also consider the broader considerations that in my mind connect JJD to so many other crimes. There are overlapping facts that narrow down the suspect list to something seemingly very small. How many people do all these things:

Calls and taunts before and after victimizing

Stalking

Never caught

Continued for periods of time

rapes

murders

has the female tie up the male, then he ties her up

pre-cut ligeratures

letters/communications to police taunting and predicting more crimes

letters to media saying "see you in the press or TV" etc

Locations and availability line up

physical descriptions, including reddish blonde hair. Not common.

forensically aware

jurisdictionally aware

homemade hoods

knife on one hip, gun on the other

boot types

red herrings/fake stories to subdue victims

Desire to create personal terror

Desire to create public terror

[almagata]

12-26-75 made this post today.  I'll be curious to hear what everyone's thoughts are.  12-26-75 attached the article image. 

_____________________

"There are a few important points about the time frame between the abduction of Donna Lass in September of 1970, and when the notorious Zodiac postcard was received six months later in March of 1971.

There had been almost no public mention of the missing woman initially. She was reportedly last seen on Sep. 6, but it would be nearly two weeks before regional press picked up the story, The family hired a private investigator to help them find Donna. His frequent quotes in the news articles suggest he sparked the initial media interest. Within a week, those stories all seemed to take a turn--she had likely just walked away.

In February of 1971, a reward fund was announced for information. At that point, the narrative was that all of the investigative leads had been exhausted.

On March 26, 1971, images of the postcard (attributed to Zodiac,) began to appear in the press. All around the world... One note that has perhaps been overlooked since the frenzy was just how much focus was on the points that connected Lake Tahoe to San Francisco, literally, that is. The Interstate-80 to be abundantly clear. Very quickly, it was pointed out that Judith Hakari had been taken under similar circumstances in Sacramento and left in Weimar, north of Auburn. Both nurses, strikingly similar appearance, and they had just "vanished."
Enter Placer County Sheriff's Office on March 29, 1971. That's when Sheriff Scott announced that his office had been searching the areas around Truckee, Donner Summit, Norden, Soda Springs, and North Lake Tahoe. Of course, that was limited by snow. Scott also announced his "invitation" to talk with the Zodiac.

In retrospect, what makes the Hakari case truly significant are that both victims (Hakari & Lass) are now identified as being 25 miles apart from one another. Measuring from their respective starting points, they were 125 miles apart. Both are a short distance off the same interstate. Hakari was found within two months of her abduction, while the remains of Donna Lass weren't collected for more than 14 years.

One of the biggest factors between the two was simply the calendar. By the time any real focus was brought to Donna Lass as a missing person, the snow was already falling on Yuba Gap. Even when the postcard was sent, it was still a time of year when the there was several feet of snow at that remote location--it doesn't normally clear until June. As the card notes: "around in the snow." By contrast, Hakari was abducted in March, and found by hikers in April.

The intense media frenzy concludes with a short, but highly accurate, article in the Sac Bee on March 28, 1971. It's "too large an are with snow conditions as they are," and "We're not enthusiastic about any immediate results from the message." And that's how it has remained for more than fifty years.

Perhaps the most important question: What if there had been more immediate outreach after Donna Lass was first reported missing? And, of course: What if she had been identified by DNA testing before now, and why did that take so long...? We will share more as it comes to light."

Attachments:

[johnnyhands1]

Dec 30, 2023 0:35:47 GMT mustangman said:

Dec 29, 2023 14:38:30 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

You hit the nail on the head, with one tweak. And this is something I have been speculating about for a while now. Guess who was a pump diver for PG&E at the time? Joseph James DeAngelo. He would have been familiar, I think, with the waterways and bodies of water because of that. He would have understood how to get there and know the roads like a local. Could have had had access to park a car near the first two attacks and LB? It was always speculated that Z was a local resident because he appeared to know the local roads. But as someone who had reason to travel them for work, could he have made himself very familiar with the area? JJD was a tactical planner. I believe he was doing some work as a welder for his step father, and also freelancing as a pump diver. Remember the Zodiac letter about Scotch tape that mentioned diving fins? Also, with respect to the Lake Berryessa attack, I have often wondered if part of the outfit was welding gear. Look through what welders wore in the late 60s. I'll post some pictures. Also consider that JJD had been a Damage controlman in the Navy. If you take a look at the flash gear they wore, it's striking in context of the outfit he wore at Lake Berryessa. It also shares some with welding head gear, which also uses clip on glasses.

Composits and photos

Flash gear damage controlman wore in the Navy at the time

clip on glasses welders used at the time

Arched text saying Boo and Scary, repeating eyeballs organically arranged

Interesting tidbit about a procedure at the time

Z and crosshatch from Damage control in Navy at the time

More Z, crosshatch and Navy Flash gear

Flash gear

Interesting tidbit from a solve to the Scorpio letter. Looks like DeGroat and Deangelo on the left to me. His parents names combined.

Deangelo attended a school very near Spaulding Lake (where Donna Lass skull was found) and another in Sacramento, both on route I-80.  The years he attended bookend the Donna Lass disappearance on Sept. 6, 1970.  So at the very least Deanglo was in close proximity, at or around the same time as both the Zodiac murders and Donna lass' disappearance.  Coincidence?? 

+++Beginning in August 1968, DeAngelo attended Sierra College in Rocklin, California; he graduated with an associate degree in police science, with honors.[36] He attended Sacramento State University in 1971, where he earned a bachelor's degree in criminal justice.+++

Are you saying he attended the Sierra College campus in Grass Valley (about 20-25 miles (?) as the crow flies from where the Lass skull was found), perhaps before, or even at the same time, he was attending the Rocklin campus?  Was there a school closer to Lake Spaulding than that he attended? 

This article says the Grass Valley/Nevada County campus didn’t open until 1996:


    catalog.sierracollege.edu/archive/2021-2022/about-sierra/brief-history-sierra-college/brief-history-sierra-college.pdf

[johnnyhands1]

Jan 1, 2024 6:42:45 GMT almagata said:

12-26-75 made this post today.  I'll be curious to hear what everyone's thoughts are.  12-26-75 attached the article image. 

_____________________

"There are a few important points about the time frame between the abduction of Donna Lass in September of 1970, and when the notorious Zodiac postcard was received six months later in March of 1971.

There had been almost no public mention of the missing woman initially. She was reportedly last seen on Sep. 6, but it would be nearly two weeks before regional press picked up the story, The family hired a private investigator to help them find Donna. His frequent quotes in the news articles suggest he sparked the initial media interest. Within a week, those stories all seemed to take a turn--she had likely just walked away.

In February of 1971, a reward fund was announced for information. At that point, the narrative was that all of the investigative leads had been exhausted.

On March 26, 1971, images of the postcard (attributed to Zodiac,) began to appear in the press. All around the world... One note that has perhaps been overlooked since the frenzy was just how much focus was on the points that connected Lake Tahoe to San Francisco, literally, that is. The Interstate-80 to be abundantly clear. Very quickly, it was pointed out that Judith Hakari had been taken under similar circumstances in Sacramento and left in Weimar, north of Auburn. Both nurses, strikingly similar appearance, and they had just "vanished."
Enter Placer County Sheriff's Office on March 29, 1971. That's when Sheriff Scott announced that his office had been searching the areas around Truckee, Donner Summit, Norden, Soda Springs, and North Lake Tahoe. Of course, that was limited by snow. Scott also announced his "invitation" to talk with the Zodiac.

In retrospect, what makes the Hakari case truly significant are that both victims (Hakari & Lass) are now identified as being 25 miles apart from one another. Measuring from their respective starting points, they were 125 miles apart. Both are a short distance off the same interstate. Hakari was found within two months of her abduction, while the remains of Donna Lass weren't collected for more than 14 years.

One of the biggest factors between the two was simply the calendar. By the time any real focus was brought to Donna Lass as a missing person, the snow was already falling on Yuba Gap. Even when the postcard was sent, it was still a time of year when the there was several feet of snow at that remote location--it doesn't normally clear until June. As the card notes: "around in the snow." By contrast, Hakari was abducted in March, and found by hikers in April.

The intense media frenzy concludes with a short, but highly accurate, article in the Sac Bee on March 28, 1971. It's "too large an are with snow conditions as they are," and "We're not enthusiastic about any immediate results from the message." And that's how it has remained for more than fifty years.

Perhaps the most important question: What if there had been more immediate outreach after Donna Lass was first reported missing? And, of course: What if she had been identified by DNA testing before now, and why did that take so long...? We will share more as it comes to light.”

Even more recently 12-26-75, on their facebook page, reposted the examples of Deangelo writing the word “vehicLe” with an upper case L vs. the address side of the “Look through the pines” postcard, where it’s addressed to “Paul Averly” of the “chronicLe” (also an upper case ‘L’).  There are six examples shown together of “icLe” that all look similar, five are from Deangelo Auburn PD reports, and the other is that postcard from the Zodiac.  Which one is the Zodiac?


www.facebook.com/December261975

(you’ll need to scroll down several posts because they've made a bunch of posts after that today.)

[almagata]

Jan 2, 2024 0:05:12 GMT johnnyhands1 said:

Jan 1, 2024 6:42:45 GMT almagata said:

12-26-75 made this post today.  I'll be curious to hear what everyone's thoughts are.  12-26-75 attached the article image. 

_____________________

"There are a few important points about the time frame between the abduction of Donna Lass in September of 1970, and when the notorious Zodiac postcard was received six months later in March of 1971.

There had been almost no public mention of the missing woman initially. She was reportedly last seen on Sep. 6, but it would be nearly two weeks before regional press picked up the story, The family hired a private investigator to help them find Donna. His frequent quotes in the news articles suggest he sparked the initial media interest. Within a week, those stories all seemed to take a turn--she had likely just walked away.

In February of 1971, a reward fund was announced for information. At that point, the narrative was that all of the investigative leads had been exhausted.

On March 26, 1971, images of the postcard (attributed to Zodiac,) began to appear in the press. All around the world... One note that has perhaps been overlooked since the frenzy was just how much focus was on the points that connected Lake Tahoe to San Francisco, literally, that is. The Interstate-80 to be abundantly clear. Very quickly, it was pointed out that Judith Hakari had been taken under similar circumstances in Sacramento and left in Weimar, north of Auburn. Both nurses, strikingly similar appearance, and they had just "vanished."
Enter Placer County Sheriff's Office on March 29, 1971. That's when Sheriff Scott announced that his office had been searching the areas around Truckee, Donner Summit, Norden, Soda Springs, and North Lake Tahoe. Of course, that was limited by snow. Scott also announced his "invitation" to talk with the Zodiac.

In retrospect, what makes the Hakari case truly significant are that both victims (Hakari & Lass) are now identified as being 25 miles apart from one another. Measuring from their respective starting points, they were 125 miles apart. Both are a short distance off the same interstate. Hakari was found within two months of her abduction, while the remains of Donna Lass weren't collected for more than 14 years.

One of the biggest factors between the two was simply the calendar. By the time any real focus was brought to Donna Lass as a missing person, the snow was already falling on Yuba Gap. Even when the postcard was sent, it was still a time of year when the there was several feet of snow at that remote location--it doesn't normally clear until June. As the card notes: "around in the snow." By contrast, Hakari was abducted in March, and found by hikers in April.

The intense media frenzy concludes with a short, but highly accurate, article in the Sac Bee on March 28, 1971. It's "too large an are with snow conditions as they are," and "We're not enthusiastic about any immediate results from the message." And that's how it has remained for more than fifty years.

Perhaps the most important question: What if there had been more immediate outreach after Donna Lass was first reported missing? And, of course: What if she had been identified by DNA testing before now, and why did that take so long...? We will share more as it comes to light.”

Even more recently 12-26-75, on their facebook page, reposted the examples of Deangelo writing the word “vehicLe” with an upper case L vs. the address side of the “Look through the pines” postcard, where it’s addressed to “Paul Averly” of the “chronicLe” (also an upper case ‘L’).  There are six examples shown together of “icLe” that all look similar, five are from Deangelo Auburn PD reports, and the other is that postcard from the Zodiac.  Which one is the Zodiac?


www.facebook.com/December261975

(you’ll need to scroll down several posts because they've made a bunch of posts after that today.)

The handwriting comparisons are so similar. 

[elroacho]

How ironic would it be if AK Wilks spent all his time trying to convince everyone Ted Kaczynski was Zodiac on the earons message boards when JJD was in fact Zodiac.

[chrisdesigner1971]

Jan 2, 2024 9:37:49 GMT elroacho said:

How ironic would it be if AK Wilks spent all his time trying to convince everyone Ted Kaczynski was Zodiac on the earons message boards when JJD was in fact Zodiac.

I think it's quite obvious JJD is Zodiac. However, given his tendency to mix red herring lies with elements of truth, or at least partial truths, I fully expect some of what we think are Z crimes are not his. I point to Cherri Jo Bates as an example. I don't know if that is a Z crime or not, but I think he successfully threw investigators in the wrong direction on many things. That helped him to avoid capture for far too long. But he also pointed them to connect Z and JJD crimes. Like all the repeating names. As I typed Cherri Jo Bates I am reminded of Donna Jo Richmond. Cheri Domingo. Robert Domingo. Robert Offerman. Bob (Robert) Coffman. Sandy as the possible early Zodiac. JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking. Two Herringtons murdered. These are just the names we know about. What about the names of the EAR victims that have not been made public? His mother's maiden name of DeGroat. And Darlene Ferrin's friend, Lorraine DeGroat, claims to have had an encounter with Zodiac. If this sounds all too fantastical, consider it again. Surely, some are coincidences. But the law of averages tells me there is something to it. Also, JJD's weird "Jerry" personality he apparently referred to with LE during his interrogation. Zodiac Jerry Connection?www.zodiacciphers.com/zodiac-news/the-good-citizen-letter-finding-jerry-at-mare-island

He really is diabolical.

[mtf65]

Jan 2, 2024 16:23:10 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

Jan 2, 2024 9:37:49 GMT elroacho said:

How ironic would it be if AK Wilks spent all his time trying to convince everyone Ted Kaczynski was Zodiac on the earons message boards when JJD was in fact Zodiac.

I think it's quite obvious JJD is Zodiac. However, given his tendency to mix red herring lies with elements of truth, or at least partial truths, I fully expect some of what we think are Z crimes are not his. I point to Cherri Jo Bates as an example. I don't know if that is a Z crime or not, but I think he successfully threw investigators in the wrong direction on many things. That helped him to avoid capture for far too long. But he also pointed them to connect Z and JJD crimes. Like all the repeating names. As I typed Cherri Jo Bates I am reminded of Donna Jo Richmond. Cheri Domingo. Robert Domingo. Robert Offerman. Bob (Robert) Coffman. Sandy as the possible early Zodiac. JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking. Two Herringtons murdered. These are just the names we know about. What about the names of the EAR victims that have not been made public? His mother's maiden name of DeGroat. And Darlene Ferrin's friend, Lorraine DeGroat, claims to have had an encounter with Zodiac. If this sounds all too fantastical, consider it again. Surely, some are coincidences. But the law of averages tells me there is something to it. Also, JJD's weird "Jerry" personality he apparently referred to with LE during his interrogation. Zodiac Jerry Connection?www.zodiacciphers.com/zodiac-news/the-good-citizen-letter-finding-jerry-at-mare-island

He really is diabolical.

"JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking".  I haven't heard of that one.  Can you point me to info on that?

[chrisdesigner1971]

Jan 2, 2024 17:36:30 GMT mtf65 said:

Jan 2, 2024 16:23:10 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

I think it's quite obvious JJD is Zodiac. However, given his tendency to mix red herring lies with elements of truth, or at least partial truths, I fully expect some of what we think are Z crimes are not his. I point to Cherri Jo Bates as an example. I don't know if that is a Z crime or not, but I think he successfully threw investigators in the wrong direction on many things. That helped him to avoid capture for far too long. But he also pointed them to connect Z and JJD crimes. Like all the repeating names. As I typed Cherri Jo Bates I am reminded of Donna Jo Richmond. Cheri Domingo. Robert Domingo. Robert Offerman. Bob (Robert) Coffman. Sandy as the possible early Zodiac. JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking. Two Herringtons murdered. These are just the names we know about. What about the names of the EAR victims that have not been made public? His mother's maiden name of DeGroat. And Darlene Ferrin's friend, Lorraine DeGroat, claims to have had an encounter with Zodiac. If this sounds all too fantastical, consider it again. Surely, some are coincidences. But the law of averages tells me there is something to it. Also, JJD's weird "Jerry" personality he apparently referred to with LE during his interrogation. Zodiac Jerry Connection?www.zodiacciphers.com/zodiac-news/the-good-citizen-letter-finding-jerry-at-mare-island

He really is diabolical.

"JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking".  I haven't heard of that one.  Can you point me to info on that?

I tried for about 15 minutes to find it, and I can't. I'm thinking maybe it was in a podcast. My recollection is that someone caught JJD prowling or stalking. And a guy gave chase. At some point, I think JJD did one of his weird deflection moves and started talking to an imaginary person named Sandy. This was quoted from a witness. I hope I can remember where I read or heard that.

[thrax]

Jan 2, 2024 18:32:42 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

Jan 2, 2024 17:36:30 GMT mtf65 said:

"JJD later heard talking to an imaginary person named Sandy during stalking".  I haven't heard of that one.  Can you point me to info on that?

I tried for about 15 minutes to find it, and I can't. I'm thinking maybe it was in a podcast. My recollection is that someone caught JJD prowling or stalking. And a guy gave chase. At some point, I think JJD did one of his weird deflection moves and started talking to an imaginary person named Sandy. This was quoted from a witness. I hope I can remember where I read or heard that.

This happened when a prowler was spotted in Visalia on Sep. 10, 1973.  A woman walking to her car saw a man leaving her yard.  When he realized she was watching him, he looked back and shouted, 'catch you later, Sandy!'  The same guy was spotted peeping through her sliding glass door a month later.  Probably JJD, but we can't really know at this point.

[chrisdesigner1971]

Jan 3, 2024 20:13:44 GMT thrax said:

Jan 2, 2024 18:32:42 GMT chrisdesigner1971 said:

I tried for about 15 minutes to find it, and I can't. I'm thinking maybe it was in a podcast. My recollection is that someone caught JJD prowling or stalking. And a guy gave chase. At some point, I think JJD did one of his weird deflection moves and started talking to an imaginary person named Sandy. This was quoted from a witness. I hope I can remember where I read or heard that.

This happened when a prowler was spotted in Visalia on Sep. 10, 1973.  A woman walking to her car saw a man leaving her yard.  When he realized she was watching him, he looked back and shouted, 'catch you later, Sandy!'  The same guy was spotted peeping through her sliding glass door a month later.  Probably JJD, but we can't really know at this point.

Thanks. Something about this seems oddly familiar with reports of JJD talking and cussing to himself. There seems to be a Jerry and a Sandy involved. Both could be loosely tied to Zodiac. But the thing with the sheer numbers of crimes JJD committed is that it devalues repeating names, etc. But not enough to make me discount them.